It sounds like you still have some work to do. Believe it or not, 99.9 percent of men, straight or not, have absolutely no interest in harming you, emotionally or physically.
All I wrote was the truth. The overwhelming majority of men don't want to hurt you. You're only limiting your life by being afraid of people simply because they're male. I don't care if you've blocked me. I wish you well.
This probably sounds maudlin because I was only 18, but I was ghosted by a boy I was very much in love with. We even talked about getting married someday. He gave me a ring. We were inseparable.
One day, for reasons I still don't know, he just went away. He wouldn't speak to me, he wouldn't look at me...it was as if we'd never met. He demanded the ring. I gave it back.
That kind of experience is just crazy-making. I can only imagine the number of hours and days of your emotional energy you've put into trying to figure out how such a thing could happen. In a way, I would judge what that guy did to you as pure sadism.
Maybe if you really want to put the best possible spin on it, you could take the position that in fact he cared for you enough to turn his back on you, knowing he would be unlikely to ever be faithful.
Oh!!!! He had a lust problem and found lust building up. No wonder he didn't say anything. He was in shame and hiding mode so couldn't admit it, a real addict.
That was way cool of your friend to share that insider info.
That was what is known as The Discard. It’s what narcissists do when they’ve sussed out a superior (in their warped estimation) form of narcissistic supply.
Count yourself extremely lucky, in the longer term. It was a blessing in disguise and your guardian angels were looking out for your best interests.
I had a girlfriend like that. We were going to get married. Then--nothing. As if we'd never been together. For no reason I was aware of. I've spent forty-five years wondering what the hell happened.
In retrospect, I realize I dodged a bullet, but I still don't understand. Fortunately I met a good woman and we've been married over forty years.
This happened to my friend about 25 years ago- she found out much later that a jealous person had told him hurtful lies about her but he never confirmed anything with my friend. He just just cut & ran. Very difficult for her to move on, took a long time….
It’s so weird that you said that. I was with my first love for two years-same thing (inseparable, thought he was “the one,” etc.) He was a year older and we’d planned to stay together the summer before but he left for college and never spoke to me again. I’m in my 30s and I can still remember how it felt. It actually traumatized me, though I know it might sound petty to others. I don’t think I’ve ever fully trusted again. People have died and it was less painful, as horrible as that sounds.
Great advice, Josh. Thank you. I need to get The Gift of Fear.
"With narcissistic people, it is usually best to quietly, slowly, back away. Become "boring." Become less communicative. Taper away, and put up boundaries."
I have been doing exactly this with my covert narcissist/histrionic mother for a long time, starting even long before my conscious mind would let me accept who she really was. However that has not stopped her from frequently bringing up bad things that happened to me decades ago that there is absolutely no reason to discuss in the present day except to try to hurt and upset me.
We live very far apart, and I am now trying to work up the courage to make this the first year that I don't spend vacation time visiting my parents. For the past few years I have spent 3 months dreading the 10-day visit and then another 3 months recovering from it. My Mom was always a guilter and shamer so it's really hard not to feel guilty about not visiting her though. And I think that she realizes that she pushed me too far the last visit, which is probably why she wrote in her Christmas card newsletter that this should be the year that I visit her for a full two weeks and then mailed it out to a hundred people.
I recommend it to everyone but especially those who have grown up in dysfunction. It's a simple and engaging read that will teach you to trust your senses. Highly , highly recommended! Thank you Josh for referring me to this book during our one on one.
We now live in an era where "ghosting" is a matter of survival. The same character-disordered individuals who accuse you of "harming" them---for holding contrarian views--- are also capable of inflicting actual physical harm on you, without hesitation. Safety first. Err on the side of caution.
I recently was ghosted by an applicant for a job I was offering (to be my sub). The over the phone interview went well and they were all go for the second interview (in person with my client). But when I tried to set up a time they wouldn't respond. I wouldn't have been offended by "I decided not to take the job."
So the ghosting helped me realize we dodged a bullet, but cost me precious time. My client has since decided she doesn't want a sub for me so looks like I'll never get a vacation.
Lets acknowledge here that ghosting isn't just to save your life. It's what the twenty something people do as a matter of course.
Love that book! It has great info that’s presented in a compelling way. There is also a video series (aka Master Class) on giftoffear.com that is an excellent supplement to the book, and it’s free!
Side note: The Gift of Fear should be ready by everyone who can read. It may very well save you from being raped or murdered. It definitely saved me from being sexually assaulted.
I wish I had read this a week ago, before my latest attempt to set boundaries with family. I probably still wouldn't have taken the advice, because part of me was still hoping against hope to get through to the cluster B, but at least part of it was shame over ghosting. It's good advice.
This mentality of ghosting family is creating a problem with young adults blocking their parents. Psychologist approved family chaos. Why? If the parent does not approve of adult child’s behavior such as substance abuse, the adult child just calls the parent a controlling narcissist and blocks the parent. It’s hurting families. People used to be able to disagree and still be in a relationship. This so called healthy ghosting is sometimes bullshit.
If you have presbyopia, a quick glance at the title looks like "When Gosling is Right." Sorta of sets the reader up for some light frivolity. But that isn't the title. And the subject matter is serious. But there is a part of me that wants to read the other topic.
My friend, I had to deal with a narcissistic woman (who pretended to be a friend) who was destroying me. The only way for me to survive and calm my wife was to adopt an absolute "no contact" strategy. Thank you for your article, I will read the book you recommend.
Very well said. I think people need to start making a distinction between “ghosting” and “no contact”. Ghosting is when we behave in a socially hurtful way to someone rather than communicating clearly to them. No contact is when we choose to cut a disordered person out of our lives for our own safety and well-being.
Also, your advice on quietly tapering off contact with narcissistic people - so that they are barely aware it’s happening - is spot on. It will help to prevent them from character assassinating you in anger, as they will probably lose interest in you themselves and simply drift away.
I have a relative who is extremely intelligent, narcissistic and arrogant beyond words. When I first visited him after years, I reacted to comments that were antagonistic and of a lecture type and got into very serious arguments which ended with him raising a fist to me and asking me if I wanted to hit him. (I thought he wanted to hit me.) Anyway, after I kept reacting to his trigger statements, I realized that the only outcome was the one he wanted which was to have the last word and to bring me down to his miserable level. So, ever after, when tempted to engage in a volatile conversation, I simply backed off and quietly said "his name and the word Stop". He took that as an opportunity to escalate and get louder. I just kept quietly saying his name and the word Stop and gently smiled. I said it about 6 times and he knew it was useless and just suddenly smiled and said "Ok". That was weird in itself like a switch had been thrown. We changed the subject. I don't expect any real changes when talking to him. He's very passive/aggressive and I avoid his subversive 'I'll get you back later' payback. So, I just don't engage and try to navigate my visits.
I have a new book in my stack called BOUNDARIES. I’m looking forward to learn how to best set healthy boundaries, especially with the Cluster Bs in my life that will use me up till I’m (in the words of Christiane Northrup) a dried up husk on the side of the road lol. But seriously, I am on board with the “slow backing away” technique and have already implemented this with a few of the takers in my life. One of these days they’ll realize that I’m missing and wonder what I did (because it couldn’t possibly be THEIR fault(s). I’m tired of being the welcome mat for so many to traipse across with dirty boots…
It sounds like you still have some work to do. Believe it or not, 99.9 percent of men, straight or not, have absolutely no interest in harming you, emotionally or physically.
Not responding out of respect for this being Josh's house, but deleting my comment and leaving now. Also blocking you for willful misreading.
All I wrote was the truth. The overwhelming majority of men don't want to hurt you. You're only limiting your life by being afraid of people simply because they're male. I don't care if you've blocked me. I wish you well.
This probably sounds maudlin because I was only 18, but I was ghosted by a boy I was very much in love with. We even talked about getting married someday. He gave me a ring. We were inseparable.
One day, for reasons I still don't know, he just went away. He wouldn't speak to me, he wouldn't look at me...it was as if we'd never met. He demanded the ring. I gave it back.
30 years later and I still don't understand.
That kind of experience is just crazy-making. I can only imagine the number of hours and days of your emotional energy you've put into trying to figure out how such a thing could happen. In a way, I would judge what that guy did to you as pure sadism.
I think so too. Oh, and get this. He told my friend (who passed it on to me) "At least she was the first girlfriend I never cheated on."
Maybe if you really want to put the best possible spin on it, you could take the position that in fact he cared for you enough to turn his back on you, knowing he would be unlikely to ever be faithful.
Oh!!!! He had a lust problem and found lust building up. No wonder he didn't say anything. He was in shame and hiding mode so couldn't admit it, a real addict.
That was way cool of your friend to share that insider info.
So, turns out he was a "slut" of the first order. I like what Humdeedee said below.
That was what is known as The Discard. It’s what narcissists do when they’ve sussed out a superior (in their warped estimation) form of narcissistic supply.
Count yourself extremely lucky, in the longer term. It was a blessing in disguise and your guardian angels were looking out for your best interests.
I had a girlfriend like that. We were going to get married. Then--nothing. As if we'd never been together. For no reason I was aware of. I've spent forty-five years wondering what the hell happened.
In retrospect, I realize I dodged a bullet, but I still don't understand. Fortunately I met a good woman and we've been married over forty years.
This happened to my friend about 25 years ago- she found out much later that a jealous person had told him hurtful lies about her but he never confirmed anything with my friend. He just just cut & ran. Very difficult for her to move on, took a long time….
It’s so weird that you said that. I was with my first love for two years-same thing (inseparable, thought he was “the one,” etc.) He was a year older and we’d planned to stay together the summer before but he left for college and never spoke to me again. I’m in my 30s and I can still remember how it felt. It actually traumatized me, though I know it might sound petty to others. I don’t think I’ve ever fully trusted again. People have died and it was less painful, as horrible as that sounds.
Great advice, Josh. Thank you. I need to get The Gift of Fear.
"With narcissistic people, it is usually best to quietly, slowly, back away. Become "boring." Become less communicative. Taper away, and put up boundaries."
I have been doing exactly this with my covert narcissist/histrionic mother for a long time, starting even long before my conscious mind would let me accept who she really was. However that has not stopped her from frequently bringing up bad things that happened to me decades ago that there is absolutely no reason to discuss in the present day except to try to hurt and upset me.
We live very far apart, and I am now trying to work up the courage to make this the first year that I don't spend vacation time visiting my parents. For the past few years I have spent 3 months dreading the 10-day visit and then another 3 months recovering from it. My Mom was always a guilter and shamer so it's really hard not to feel guilty about not visiting her though. And I think that she realizes that she pushed me too far the last visit, which is probably why she wrote in her Christmas card newsletter that this should be the year that I visit her for a full two weeks and then mailed it out to a hundred people.
The Gift of Fear is an excellent book .
I recommend it to everyone but especially those who have grown up in dysfunction. It's a simple and engaging read that will teach you to trust your senses. Highly , highly recommended! Thank you Josh for referring me to this book during our one on one.
We now live in an era where "ghosting" is a matter of survival. The same character-disordered individuals who accuse you of "harming" them---for holding contrarian views--- are also capable of inflicting actual physical harm on you, without hesitation. Safety first. Err on the side of caution.
I recently was ghosted by an applicant for a job I was offering (to be my sub). The over the phone interview went well and they were all go for the second interview (in person with my client). But when I tried to set up a time they wouldn't respond. I wouldn't have been offended by "I decided not to take the job."
So the ghosting helped me realize we dodged a bullet, but cost me precious time. My client has since decided she doesn't want a sub for me so looks like I'll never get a vacation.
Lets acknowledge here that ghosting isn't just to save your life. It's what the twenty something people do as a matter of course.
Love that book! It has great info that’s presented in a compelling way. There is also a video series (aka Master Class) on giftoffear.com that is an excellent supplement to the book, and it’s free!
Side note: The Gift of Fear should be ready by everyone who can read. It may very well save you from being raped or murdered. It definitely saved me from being sexually assaulted.
There’s times you know you have to back away and then slip away. Particularly when you dealing with a “needy” personality.
I wish I had read this a week ago, before my latest attempt to set boundaries with family. I probably still wouldn't have taken the advice, because part of me was still hoping against hope to get through to the cluster B, but at least part of it was shame over ghosting. It's good advice.
This mentality of ghosting family is creating a problem with young adults blocking their parents. Psychologist approved family chaos. Why? If the parent does not approve of adult child’s behavior such as substance abuse, the adult child just calls the parent a controlling narcissist and blocks the parent. It’s hurting families. People used to be able to disagree and still be in a relationship. This so called healthy ghosting is sometimes bullshit.
If you have presbyopia, a quick glance at the title looks like "When Gosling is Right." Sorta of sets the reader up for some light frivolity. But that isn't the title. And the subject matter is serious. But there is a part of me that wants to read the other topic.
My friend, I had to deal with a narcissistic woman (who pretended to be a friend) who was destroying me. The only way for me to survive and calm my wife was to adopt an absolute "no contact" strategy. Thank you for your article, I will read the book you recommend.
Very well said. I think people need to start making a distinction between “ghosting” and “no contact”. Ghosting is when we behave in a socially hurtful way to someone rather than communicating clearly to them. No contact is when we choose to cut a disordered person out of our lives for our own safety and well-being.
Also, your advice on quietly tapering off contact with narcissistic people - so that they are barely aware it’s happening - is spot on. It will help to prevent them from character assassinating you in anger, as they will probably lose interest in you themselves and simply drift away.
I have a relative who is extremely intelligent, narcissistic and arrogant beyond words. When I first visited him after years, I reacted to comments that were antagonistic and of a lecture type and got into very serious arguments which ended with him raising a fist to me and asking me if I wanted to hit him. (I thought he wanted to hit me.) Anyway, after I kept reacting to his trigger statements, I realized that the only outcome was the one he wanted which was to have the last word and to bring me down to his miserable level. So, ever after, when tempted to engage in a volatile conversation, I simply backed off and quietly said "his name and the word Stop". He took that as an opportunity to escalate and get louder. I just kept quietly saying his name and the word Stop and gently smiled. I said it about 6 times and he knew it was useless and just suddenly smiled and said "Ok". That was weird in itself like a switch had been thrown. We changed the subject. I don't expect any real changes when talking to him. He's very passive/aggressive and I avoid his subversive 'I'll get you back later' payback. So, I just don't engage and try to navigate my visits.
I have a new book in my stack called BOUNDARIES. I’m looking forward to learn how to best set healthy boundaries, especially with the Cluster Bs in my life that will use me up till I’m (in the words of Christiane Northrup) a dried up husk on the side of the road lol. But seriously, I am on board with the “slow backing away” technique and have already implemented this with a few of the takers in my life. One of these days they’ll realize that I’m missing and wonder what I did (because it couldn’t possibly be THEIR fault(s). I’m tired of being the welcome mat for so many to traipse across with dirty boots…