I was really young when she was popular too. I’m also a big fan-her voice is unmistakable and so beautiful. I also remember her death -I didn’t know anything about anorexia but would learn soon as it exploded in teens. RIP, Karen 💙
She had a wonderful and unique voice and is sorely missed. I have a few Carpenters’ tracks on my phone to listen to relaxing, driving, etc. The Carpenters played USAFA when I was a cadet - class of 76. I, too, was saddened when she passed away.
"Oh that voice!"--I'mma longtime Carpenters fan--loved 'em even while listenin' to the likes of the Sex Pistols ... Never had a whit've shame at my exceedin'ly eclectic tastes (to this day I'm also a forever-fan of the Osmonds an' took no small amount of razzin' for it... all of 'em, I later learned, underwent mkultra an' a lotta abuse themselves--many don't know just how talented they were playin' multiple instruments, singin', dancin'....etc; anywho, I never know 'bout Karen's cold mother--so sad)-- I think of her singin' as bein' crystaline--pure--transparent even... who knew of the very real pain? RIP Karen...
This wuz one of the loveliest tributes ever to her...mucho thanks fer it!
"all of 'em, I later learned, underwent mkultra an' a lotta abuse themselves"
Wait, what?
I just looked up "osmonds mkultra" and found a Humphrey Osmond who was involved with psychedelics in a therapeutic setting. But the singing group? I hadn't heard that.
I've been readin' up on a lot of the SRA "famblies" an' both the Osmonds and the Jacksons (i.e. Jackson 5 incl. Michael) were all abused, passed 'round hollyweird (Diddy-like parties), given meds to make 'em all stay up for DAYS to practice all their music, Marie given diet pills an' uppers--both families had cruel fathers an' mothers that looked the other way... Mormons (in the Osmond's case) an' Jehovah's Witnesses (in the Jacksons) -- there are some cult like elements in both groups...
I cain't recall the specific reference for the Osmonds but I THINK it was Cathy O'Brien's "Trance Formation of America" book as she mentions a lotta performers that were under "handlers"--I think she or Brice Taylor ("Thanks for the Memories") spoke about 'em. Osmond's dad was military (often in SRA households) an' came from a very abusive home too... Re Mormons: The Romney fambly (Mitch, AND his twisted daddy-o, etc) were all abusers--it's really a thing, sadly, with Mormons (not all of course). Marie also did a tell-all book an' mentioned her sexual abuse from a young age (under 8) :
Jackson 5--the father was the real abuser (again, the mom just looked the other way but didn't help)--Michael got the worst of it. Also they worked round the clock for days at a time--all've 'em...
So tho' I do not believe Karen Carpenter suffered that level of abuse--no question she experienced a high level of it... such a tragic loss fer us all
In the article you linked, it says says "it was the positive relationship she had with her father and brothers that helped her work through those feelings." Which sounds like the abuse didn't come from inside her family.
"it's really a thing, sadly, with Mormons"
It really isn't, tho, not with the mainstream church. The spin-offs are a different story.
yup, Satanic Ritual Abuse... Marie may not recall ALL she underwent as they split the personalities an' they dissociate--literally--what used ta be called schizophrenia is often now shown to be derived from abuse... so we may never know for sure-- her abuse may've come from others in their church too as the elders an' others sometimes take advantage with or sometimes without parental consent...
I did hear that the non-stop rehearsals were from the father more than the mother (Olive) an' that even the boys were abused but that may have just been by producers an' others--it's not different from all the P.Diddy stuff (Menendez bros. too)-- the drugs have changed, the manipulation hasn't... I'm on a learnin' curve with this but other musical prodigies have had this happen...
OH an' Sinead O'Connor's mom was even worse than Karen Carpenters--she physically beat her an' may have been involved in SRA... wrong these young talents (wull they started young) had to suffer so much...
Yes yes, yer right the "normie" church members are not dealin' with this but there are those in power--in many faiths--that do this... it comes from higher up... but you couldn't tell from outside the door...like with the masons--the lower levels are just networkin' an' doin' good works in the community--higher ups--some dark stuff sad ta say... so I think it's like that with the LDS too...
I'm a sixth-generation member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (mainstream), and there's no ritual abuse in my church -- not as a matter of course.
Unfortunately, we have pedos among us (because they're everywhere), and they do a lot of damage. Some of them are fathers who use "churchy" excuses for what they do. Sociopaths arise in every setting, and they're very good at camouflage. But when they're caught they're expelled -- and prosecuted, when possible.
As children in the church we're in contact with a lot of trusted adults, such that if one adult breaks trust, there are always other adults we can tell.
No one ever tried anything with me, nor with my sisters nor my friends. That's the norm. Where we find exceptions, we try hard to expel the perps and help the victims heal.
Yup, like I was sayin' -- "the "normie" church members are not dealin' with this" but it's those "in power--in many faiths--that do this" bad stuff. They manipulate the child's beliefs an' trusts... But as I said it comes from higher up.
MOST don't experience it--thankfully you didn't either! But bloodline famblies (in any faith btw) are often victmized... the kids.
As I said, the masons (variations--rosicrucians, etc) have certain corrupt (dangerous) individuals involved in many aspects of many faiths--so it's not LDS or Jesuits or Orthodox Jews or any one "faith" but ruther many are very much infiltrated--some more than others (eg. Catholics far more so than Protestants). Again, the Romneys are a good example of those dark forces in the LDS... it's not the faith itself, it's those that turn it upside down an' "use" it...
With Sinead it was the Catholic church... Osmonds, LDS... Jacksons, Jehova's Witnesses-- the important part is that people are now comin' forth, speakin' up. Some don't remember cuz memories were suppressed but they have trauma flashbacks... Anywho... what I wanted ta say is that so much musical talent has to undergo abuse--either via their entire famblies or just via some velly bad individuals (like Karen Carpenter's ma)... whom I never knew about!
I hope some'a this comes out with the whole Diddy mess--many were brought into those circles kickin' an' screamin'... If ya asked me all 'bout this stuff even a few years ago I wouldn't'a believed it... Once it's known--there'll be no more shame--no hidin'--an' then healing (we hope!) will take place...
Amen to that. 1972, freshmen in HS, borrowed my younger sisters carpenter records, and never gave them back. Still listen to her all the time. I wanted to save her, too.
We've Only Just Begun was a hit simultaneously with Different Drum (Linda Ronstadt). Those were confusing times in pop music-- on the one had, the idealization of monogamy; on the other, its disavowal.
Thanks, Josh, you nailed what I had expected was the cause of CC's death, a narcissistic mother. She had a beautiful voice in a beautiful song. An even greater favourite for me is Annie Lennox, eg: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D86EoHA_L5o .
The Eurhythmics work was so emotionally powerful to me that I couldn't listen to it when it first came out, had to wait another nearly 10 years 'till my emotions had caught up (I had a narc mother too).
My sign is Cancer, and I got emotional listening to that song. I picked up the guitar two years ago, so in honor of you and her I intend to listen to her work and learn how to sing and play one of her songs.
"The Carpenters were everywhere in the 1970s. We’ve Only Just Begun was everyone’s wedding song. Turn on a tinny AM radio in any car and out came her velvet syrup voice, double-tracked in that signature way.
"As with disco, it became fashionable to “hate” the Carpenters. There were vanilla. They were corny. "
Boy howdy, do I remember that. In the early 70s we used to go to a friend's house to listen to the parents' Carpenters albums. They were so incredibly popular. Bigger than life.
Same with Saturday Night Fever and the BeeGees. That album was hotter than hot. I couldn't afford it at $12, so my mom bought me the sheet music for piano. (I never mastered the pieces, which didn't sound all that good on piano anyway.)
And then suddenly the celebs on the nighttime talk shows started sneering at the Carpenters. Like Josh said, they were seen as too square to bear. The BeeGees were also disdained as passé. It was as if everyone were embarrassed at how emotionally involved we'd been, and so now we had to distance ourselves from the sappiness. Like teens ditching their affection for their parents or their childhood obsessions.
That had always struck me as dumb. If the music was good then, it's good now. Why choose what you like based on whether the kool kids are sneering at it? Why be so shallow and fickle?
I didn't know Karen's mom was Cluster B, but it makes sense in light of her anorexia. Imagine how many more lovely songs she'd have produced in the absence of that cruelty. Or would she? What if the cruelty was an irreplaceable ingredient in her performances?
One of my favorite artists. Her songs I sang along with (poorly), but I certainly memorized so many of their lyrics. Takes me right back to my turbulent teen years. Instantly recognizable voice. Lord, she was phenomenal - her breath work, control, range - the low notes. Oh, the low notes.
It hurts my heart that her life was cut short, and that in spite of her success, she always seemed just a bit lost and sad. 😔
Not gonna lie. She is one Karen I don't mind sharing the name with.
I was really young when she was popular too. I’m also a big fan-her voice is unmistakable and so beautiful. I also remember her death -I didn’t know anything about anorexia but would learn soon as it exploded in teens. RIP, Karen 💙
She had a wonderful and unique voice and is sorely missed. I have a few Carpenters’ tracks on my phone to listen to relaxing, driving, etc. The Carpenters played USAFA when I was a cadet - class of 76. I, too, was saddened when she passed away.
Flawless. Both Karen, and your piece.
She had a range that cannot be duplicated digitally. It's that magnificent.
"Oh that voice!"--I'mma longtime Carpenters fan--loved 'em even while listenin' to the likes of the Sex Pistols ... Never had a whit've shame at my exceedin'ly eclectic tastes (to this day I'm also a forever-fan of the Osmonds an' took no small amount of razzin' for it... all of 'em, I later learned, underwent mkultra an' a lotta abuse themselves--many don't know just how talented they were playin' multiple instruments, singin', dancin'....etc; anywho, I never know 'bout Karen's cold mother--so sad)-- I think of her singin' as bein' crystaline--pure--transparent even... who knew of the very real pain? RIP Karen...
This wuz one of the loveliest tributes ever to her...mucho thanks fer it!
"all of 'em, I later learned, underwent mkultra an' a lotta abuse themselves"
Wait, what?
I just looked up "osmonds mkultra" and found a Humphrey Osmond who was involved with psychedelics in a therapeutic setting. But the singing group? I hadn't heard that.
I've been readin' up on a lot of the SRA "famblies" an' both the Osmonds and the Jacksons (i.e. Jackson 5 incl. Michael) were all abused, passed 'round hollyweird (Diddy-like parties), given meds to make 'em all stay up for DAYS to practice all their music, Marie given diet pills an' uppers--both families had cruel fathers an' mothers that looked the other way... Mormons (in the Osmond's case) an' Jehovah's Witnesses (in the Jacksons) -- there are some cult like elements in both groups...
I cain't recall the specific reference for the Osmonds but I THINK it was Cathy O'Brien's "Trance Formation of America" book as she mentions a lotta performers that were under "handlers"--I think she or Brice Taylor ("Thanks for the Memories") spoke about 'em. Osmond's dad was military (often in SRA households) an' came from a very abusive home too... Re Mormons: The Romney fambly (Mitch, AND his twisted daddy-o, etc) were all abusers--it's really a thing, sadly, with Mormons (not all of course). Marie also did a tell-all book an' mentioned her sexual abuse from a young age (under 8) :
https://www.thelist.com/312009/the-untold-truth-of-marie-osmond/
Jackson 5--the father was the real abuser (again, the mom just looked the other way but didn't help)--Michael got the worst of it. Also they worked round the clock for days at a time--all've 'em...
So tho' I do not believe Karen Carpenter suffered that level of abuse--no question she experienced a high level of it... such a tragic loss fer us all
Does SRA mean satanic ritual abuse?
In the article you linked, it says says "it was the positive relationship she had with her father and brothers that helped her work through those feelings." Which sounds like the abuse didn't come from inside her family.
"it's really a thing, sadly, with Mormons"
It really isn't, tho, not with the mainstream church. The spin-offs are a different story.
yup, Satanic Ritual Abuse... Marie may not recall ALL she underwent as they split the personalities an' they dissociate--literally--what used ta be called schizophrenia is often now shown to be derived from abuse... so we may never know for sure-- her abuse may've come from others in their church too as the elders an' others sometimes take advantage with or sometimes without parental consent...
I did hear that the non-stop rehearsals were from the father more than the mother (Olive) an' that even the boys were abused but that may have just been by producers an' others--it's not different from all the P.Diddy stuff (Menendez bros. too)-- the drugs have changed, the manipulation hasn't... I'm on a learnin' curve with this but other musical prodigies have had this happen...
OH an' Sinead O'Connor's mom was even worse than Karen Carpenters--she physically beat her an' may have been involved in SRA... wrong these young talents (wull they started young) had to suffer so much...
Yes yes, yer right the "normie" church members are not dealin' with this but there are those in power--in many faiths--that do this... it comes from higher up... but you couldn't tell from outside the door...like with the masons--the lower levels are just networkin' an' doin' good works in the community--higher ups--some dark stuff sad ta say... so I think it's like that with the LDS too...
I'm a sixth-generation member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (mainstream), and there's no ritual abuse in my church -- not as a matter of course.
Unfortunately, we have pedos among us (because they're everywhere), and they do a lot of damage. Some of them are fathers who use "churchy" excuses for what they do. Sociopaths arise in every setting, and they're very good at camouflage. But when they're caught they're expelled -- and prosecuted, when possible.
As children in the church we're in contact with a lot of trusted adults, such that if one adult breaks trust, there are always other adults we can tell.
No one ever tried anything with me, nor with my sisters nor my friends. That's the norm. Where we find exceptions, we try hard to expel the perps and help the victims heal.
Yup, like I was sayin' -- "the "normie" church members are not dealin' with this" but it's those "in power--in many faiths--that do this" bad stuff. They manipulate the child's beliefs an' trusts... But as I said it comes from higher up.
MOST don't experience it--thankfully you didn't either! But bloodline famblies (in any faith btw) are often victmized... the kids.
As I said, the masons (variations--rosicrucians, etc) have certain corrupt (dangerous) individuals involved in many aspects of many faiths--so it's not LDS or Jesuits or Orthodox Jews or any one "faith" but ruther many are very much infiltrated--some more than others (eg. Catholics far more so than Protestants). Again, the Romneys are a good example of those dark forces in the LDS... it's not the faith itself, it's those that turn it upside down an' "use" it...
With Sinead it was the Catholic church... Osmonds, LDS... Jacksons, Jehova's Witnesses-- the important part is that people are now comin' forth, speakin' up. Some don't remember cuz memories were suppressed but they have trauma flashbacks... Anywho... what I wanted ta say is that so much musical talent has to undergo abuse--either via their entire famblies or just via some velly bad individuals (like Karen Carpenter's ma)... whom I never knew about!
I hope some'a this comes out with the whole Diddy mess--many were brought into those circles kickin' an' screamin'... If ya asked me all 'bout this stuff even a few years ago I wouldn't'a believed it... Once it's known--there'll be no more shame--no hidin'--an' then healing (we hope!) will take place...
Thanks for this. I’m a big Leon Russell fan, nice to hear this version of A Song For You.
It's nice that you're taking your personal pain and making something positive out of it. Most people couldn't do that.
Amen to that. 1972, freshmen in HS, borrowed my younger sisters carpenter records, and never gave them back. Still listen to her all the time. I wanted to save her, too.
We've Only Just Begun was a hit simultaneously with Different Drum (Linda Ronstadt). Those were confusing times in pop music-- on the one had, the idealization of monogamy; on the other, its disavowal.
Thanks, Josh, you nailed what I had expected was the cause of CC's death, a narcissistic mother. She had a beautiful voice in a beautiful song. An even greater favourite for me is Annie Lennox, eg: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D86EoHA_L5o .
The Eurhythmics work was so emotionally powerful to me that I couldn't listen to it when it first came out, had to wait another nearly 10 years 'till my emotions had caught up (I had a narc mother too).
My sign is Cancer, and I got emotional listening to that song. I picked up the guitar two years ago, so in honor of you and her I intend to listen to her work and learn how to sing and play one of her songs.
“lack theory of mind” i have to chuckle, I’ve been saying they have “faulty thinking” your phrase holds more weight and what it IS.
"The Carpenters were everywhere in the 1970s. We’ve Only Just Begun was everyone’s wedding song. Turn on a tinny AM radio in any car and out came her velvet syrup voice, double-tracked in that signature way.
"As with disco, it became fashionable to “hate” the Carpenters. There were vanilla. They were corny. "
Boy howdy, do I remember that. In the early 70s we used to go to a friend's house to listen to the parents' Carpenters albums. They were so incredibly popular. Bigger than life.
Same with Saturday Night Fever and the BeeGees. That album was hotter than hot. I couldn't afford it at $12, so my mom bought me the sheet music for piano. (I never mastered the pieces, which didn't sound all that good on piano anyway.)
And then suddenly the celebs on the nighttime talk shows started sneering at the Carpenters. Like Josh said, they were seen as too square to bear. The BeeGees were also disdained as passé. It was as if everyone were embarrassed at how emotionally involved we'd been, and so now we had to distance ourselves from the sappiness. Like teens ditching their affection for their parents or their childhood obsessions.
That had always struck me as dumb. If the music was good then, it's good now. Why choose what you like based on whether the kool kids are sneering at it? Why be so shallow and fickle?
I didn't know Karen's mom was Cluster B, but it makes sense in light of her anorexia. Imagine how many more lovely songs she'd have produced in the absence of that cruelty. Or would she? What if the cruelty was an irreplaceable ingredient in her performances?
One of my favorite artists. Her songs I sang along with (poorly), but I certainly memorized so many of their lyrics. Takes me right back to my turbulent teen years. Instantly recognizable voice. Lord, she was phenomenal - her breath work, control, range - the low notes. Oh, the low notes.
It hurts my heart that her life was cut short, and that in spite of her success, she always seemed just a bit lost and sad. 😔
Not gonna lie. She is one Karen I don't mind sharing the name with.
Josh, I think you would really love this singer / songwriter.
https://haleyheynderickx.bandcamp.com/album/seed-of-a-seed?from=fanpub_fnb_pr
She had the most truly amazing voice.