I truly appreciated this whole piece and maybe especially your allusions to each of the bits of literature. I got each one, and immediately felt like we are the same era, cut from the same generational references.
And yes, it will end.
One of my favorite mantras is this:
All things are impermanent.
They arise and they pass away.
Being in harmony with this truth
Brings great happiness.
This means those intense, strong feelings that grip us as well as the big waves of "circumstance." They will pass.
I used to really wallow in negative moods. I realized only recently that watching and consuming lighter content like comedy really helps my mood. I like being funny in my social life but for some reason I mainly watch serious drama
Great writing, Josh. Panic and anxiety seem to diminish with age, while depression increases in frequency. At least, that's been my experience. In addition to medication, my coping mechanisms include listening to podcasts that interest me, such as yours. They remind me that I am a whole person. Putting yourself together after falling apart is almost a physical feeling. Not to be too self-righteous about it, but exercise has been really effective for me: natural dopamin pumped into your brain, a sense of well-being and self-respect, as well as fatigue sufficient to put you to sleep at night are all good things. I talk to friends and family. I don't have pets, but they are probably life savers. Finally, long, 12-hour work days leave you too tired to cry.
I've found that, at the age of seventy, depression and anxiety seem to be growing worse. Yes, exercise helps, but it's harder and harder to force myself to do it.
I am sorry for depressive state you find yourself in. I am hopeful for you since you are experiencing a little corner turn. Let the winds of those that understand and support you assist in the push out of the darkness. I, too, have been in a funk that would likely be diagnosed as chronic depression for quite a while now. Given the host of true challenges and threats to your life recently, even one of which might overwhelm the most stoic among us, it seems sort of natural that this would happen. Reminder, the lack of sunlight we experience in the northeast can also exacerbate depression proclivities. In my experience, moving away from depression requires, DOING things. This of course is incredibly hard since the depression wants to hold you down and in stasis. It is a fight. One that often comes in fits and starts, but is a hole that can be dug out of....
I wish for you expanding moments of calm, awareness of the love that does surround you, and hope. The hole can be deep, but there are often some things you can use to fill in the bottom allowing the climb out to be less strenuous. Peace and love to you
Thank you for sharing this Josh. Amazingly written and so very honest and human.
The only time I have experienced anything similar has been on a massive dose of psychedelics. I have taken a lot of psychedelics but have pushed it way too far on occasions and what you describe here feels very reminiscent of that kind of extremely scary, very dark intensity that takes you over.
In the same way, knowing it will come to an end is really important when in that state or you feel like you could stay like that forever which is absolutely terrifying.
I hope I'm not belittling your experience by comparing it to a psychedelic one, but it really does seem very similar.
I'm glad you seem to be coming out the other side.
What a thing to live with.
Amazing that you do what you do and have the strength & ability to describe it so well. I'm sure this will be a help and a comfort for others struggling.
Have you ever tried EFT, Emotional Freedom Technique? It has helped me with a lot of things, including PTSD after being raped and almost murdered by a complete stranger in the street. Combining talk therapy with EFT was the magic bullet for me. Please check it out, it looks simplistic and gimmicky, but it's actually a real therapy, it's just that no one can explain how it works, but there seems to be a connection between balancing energy points on the face, with reorganising the brain, always in a good way, you can't possibly get bad results, the worst thing that can happen is nothing, you've wasted 5 minutes.
I've had EFT sessions (it can be done with a therapist or by yourself) where after I tapped for a few minutes while thinking about an issue or experience, words would pop into my mind, that reframed the issue in a newer, healthier way. So I could see the old situation from a position of health and detachment.
Keep writing and keep speaking out. It’s good therapy and you have a needed and rare honesty about the current spate of insanity and evil that few including in the “conservative space” would touch with a twelve inch erection. The world needs people like you even when so many of its inhabitants really aren’t worth the effort.
Thank you Josh. Your post was just what I needed today. While I am not suffering from depression currently, I am looking at things (for purpose of healing) things that are hard to look at. I felt less alone and more compassion for myself.
Wow, I read those same books as a child numerous times. My escape at the time.
"Black hole" depressions, starting in grade school; hiding those from others, yep; anxiety / panic attacks, you bet! I didn't mess around with "feelings", though, I just went straight to out cold on the floor in 30 seconds or less from onset! Now for the " good" news: there is a way out, and it is not pills! To get out you have to go back to its roots, most often before you were forming conscious memories, and go through again, but this time in a safe environment. It helps, if you have Jesus and the Holy Spirit with you for that, because 1 aspect of it no one talks about is the spiritual aspect, and Satan does not let go easily! Part of the reason drugs don't work (had you noticed that yet?) is because the root source of drugs is sorcery. I doubt your therapist mentioned that, but the Greek word for sorcery is "pharmakeia" from which we anglicize pharmacy (drug dispensary) and pharmacopia (a compendium of all drugs in use).
I suspect the reason your depression has started lifting is a combination of detoxification, and lengthening days at this time of year. Mine always seemed to break as the days began to lengthen too. If you need some kind of support, get yourself some DLPA (dextro and levo phenylalanine), a natural mood elevator found in cocoa beans, hence the cravings women get for chocolate, specifically, around menstruation. No side effects, not even the calories, in capsule form, and it can help through the darkest times while you're working through. No addiction either. Any questions, feel free to ask.
I used to have severe bouts of clinical depression in my teens and twenties. Then in 2008 I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism after I found a holistic doctor willing to do a full thyroid panel. 99% of doctors only run a TSH and FT4, but the most important labs are FT3, both antibodies, and RT3 which this doctor actually ran. Lo and behold I found out that I had Hashimoto's thyroiditis.
I was put on thyroid medication and have never experienced "endogenous depression" again. Sure, I experienced terrible grief after my beloved mother died and a lot of depression when I was severely ill. However, I have never ever had a black fog descend on me out of the blue since 2008. I have since learned that depression is a common symptom of hypothyroidism and that T3 is in fact used for treatment resistant depression.
I am not saying you definitely have hypothyroidism, Josh. Just sharing my story in case it helps anyone. I truly believe that there are more physical causes of depression than we realise.
Thank you for sharing this with us. I struggle greatly with social anxiety. Sometimes, I can't even leave the bedroom. At its worst, I'll talk myself out of plans, even if it's something I'm looking forward to. Last Wednesday, I had to talk myself out of talking myself out of attending a stamp club meeting. I picked up my friend and we had a good time. Still, I had to hide myself under a scarf, which did not go unnoticed. When I got in bed that night, I was in physical pain. My shoulders and upper back were screaming. Perhaps forcing myself to leave the house had physical ramifications.
I feel like I'm rambling. I suppose sharing this is cathartic. I'm working on it.
If you think Placentia is funny, about thirty miles northeast we have a town called Cucamonga.
Social anxiety sucks. As I get older, it gets worse and worse. In my head I know that nobody is going to harm me, but I just can't face going to a house full of people. If I do, I end up feeling like I can't breathe, I'm going to freak out, and I have to escape. I'll do almost anything to get out of going. My wife, a gregarious person, finds my condition to be quite a nuisance.
Once upon a time, I had a friend who struggled as you do. It took me some time to understand that I couldn't hang on tight enough, pull hard enough, pray often enough, or hope fervently enough to pull my friend back from the brink. I finally had to accept that I had no idea how to help, what to say, what to do, when to say or do anything - or say or do nothing. All I could do was reach out to check up with no expectations and promise to be there whenever the clouds lifted.
Words seem inadequate to touch what you've shared and do justice to acknowledging what you go through when your mind betrays you.
The only words I can think to say are - you continue to inspire me, Josh. I am better for having stumbled across your podcast. I'm not going anywhere.
*Thank you*, @kbi, for sharing your hard-won insights. As I’m sure you know, the helplessness that you experienced in caring for your friend is just a sliver of the helplessness that a deeply depressed person feels in his or her darkest moments and struggles. It is moving to read that you acknowledged and came to terms with that helplessness in your role as a caregiving friend. Your willingness to do so, and to be present in the moment with your friend in his or her suffering, very likely made you one of your friend’s strongest allies in his or her depression battle. Moreover, your open acknowledgment of the caregiver’s ultimate helplessness in such situations also likely protected you from falling into that dark pit with your friend, thus shielding you but also importantly making you an even more stalwart ally to your friend.
I don't know anything biographical about Jung. I wonder if he was ever depressed.
What a poignant, heartfelt and intensely personal post Josh. Thank you for sharing this with your readers.
Beautifully and painfully described, Josh.
Thank you.
I truly appreciated this whole piece and maybe especially your allusions to each of the bits of literature. I got each one, and immediately felt like we are the same era, cut from the same generational references.
And yes, it will end.
One of my favorite mantras is this:
All things are impermanent.
They arise and they pass away.
Being in harmony with this truth
Brings great happiness.
This means those intense, strong feelings that grip us as well as the big waves of "circumstance." They will pass.
May you be blessed as you've blessed others. 🙏
Stand-up comedy helps me with depression better than any counseling or medication.
Perhaps another subscriber can curate a few playlists on whatever commercial free platform you use.
CleanTube app suppresses YouTube ads for free, if you don't have something like Spotify premium.
I used to really wallow in negative moods. I realized only recently that watching and consuming lighter content like comedy really helps my mood. I like being funny in my social life but for some reason I mainly watch serious drama
Great writing, Josh. Panic and anxiety seem to diminish with age, while depression increases in frequency. At least, that's been my experience. In addition to medication, my coping mechanisms include listening to podcasts that interest me, such as yours. They remind me that I am a whole person. Putting yourself together after falling apart is almost a physical feeling. Not to be too self-righteous about it, but exercise has been really effective for me: natural dopamin pumped into your brain, a sense of well-being and self-respect, as well as fatigue sufficient to put you to sleep at night are all good things. I talk to friends and family. I don't have pets, but they are probably life savers. Finally, long, 12-hour work days leave you too tired to cry.
I've found that, at the age of seventy, depression and anxiety seem to be growing worse. Yes, exercise helps, but it's harder and harder to force myself to do it.
I hear that. Everyone is different. Wishing you well.
Hi Josh;
I am sorry for depressive state you find yourself in. I am hopeful for you since you are experiencing a little corner turn. Let the winds of those that understand and support you assist in the push out of the darkness. I, too, have been in a funk that would likely be diagnosed as chronic depression for quite a while now. Given the host of true challenges and threats to your life recently, even one of which might overwhelm the most stoic among us, it seems sort of natural that this would happen. Reminder, the lack of sunlight we experience in the northeast can also exacerbate depression proclivities. In my experience, moving away from depression requires, DOING things. This of course is incredibly hard since the depression wants to hold you down and in stasis. It is a fight. One that often comes in fits and starts, but is a hole that can be dug out of....
I wish for you expanding moments of calm, awareness of the love that does surround you, and hope. The hole can be deep, but there are often some things you can use to fill in the bottom allowing the climb out to be less strenuous. Peace and love to you
Thank you for sharing this Josh. Amazingly written and so very honest and human.
The only time I have experienced anything similar has been on a massive dose of psychedelics. I have taken a lot of psychedelics but have pushed it way too far on occasions and what you describe here feels very reminiscent of that kind of extremely scary, very dark intensity that takes you over.
In the same way, knowing it will come to an end is really important when in that state or you feel like you could stay like that forever which is absolutely terrifying.
I hope I'm not belittling your experience by comparing it to a psychedelic one, but it really does seem very similar.
I'm glad you seem to be coming out the other side.
What a thing to live with.
Amazing that you do what you do and have the strength & ability to describe it so well. I'm sure this will be a help and a comfort for others struggling.
X
You're a breath of fresh air. Seriously. Really appreciate it.
Have you ever tried EFT, Emotional Freedom Technique? It has helped me with a lot of things, including PTSD after being raped and almost murdered by a complete stranger in the street. Combining talk therapy with EFT was the magic bullet for me. Please check it out, it looks simplistic and gimmicky, but it's actually a real therapy, it's just that no one can explain how it works, but there seems to be a connection between balancing energy points on the face, with reorganising the brain, always in a good way, you can't possibly get bad results, the worst thing that can happen is nothing, you've wasted 5 minutes.
I've had EFT sessions (it can be done with a therapist or by yourself) where after I tapped for a few minutes while thinking about an issue or experience, words would pop into my mind, that reframed the issue in a newer, healthier way. So I could see the old situation from a position of health and detachment.
That sounds crazy, but like you said, the worst that can happen is a few wasted minutes. I'm gonna check it out. Thanks.
Keep writing and keep speaking out. It’s good therapy and you have a needed and rare honesty about the current spate of insanity and evil that few including in the “conservative space” would touch with a twelve inch erection. The world needs people like you even when so many of its inhabitants really aren’t worth the effort.
Thank you Josh. Your post was just what I needed today. While I am not suffering from depression currently, I am looking at things (for purpose of healing) things that are hard to look at. I felt less alone and more compassion for myself.
Wow, I read those same books as a child numerous times. My escape at the time.
"Black hole" depressions, starting in grade school; hiding those from others, yep; anxiety / panic attacks, you bet! I didn't mess around with "feelings", though, I just went straight to out cold on the floor in 30 seconds or less from onset! Now for the " good" news: there is a way out, and it is not pills! To get out you have to go back to its roots, most often before you were forming conscious memories, and go through again, but this time in a safe environment. It helps, if you have Jesus and the Holy Spirit with you for that, because 1 aspect of it no one talks about is the spiritual aspect, and Satan does not let go easily! Part of the reason drugs don't work (had you noticed that yet?) is because the root source of drugs is sorcery. I doubt your therapist mentioned that, but the Greek word for sorcery is "pharmakeia" from which we anglicize pharmacy (drug dispensary) and pharmacopia (a compendium of all drugs in use).
I suspect the reason your depression has started lifting is a combination of detoxification, and lengthening days at this time of year. Mine always seemed to break as the days began to lengthen too. If you need some kind of support, get yourself some DLPA (dextro and levo phenylalanine), a natural mood elevator found in cocoa beans, hence the cravings women get for chocolate, specifically, around menstruation. No side effects, not even the calories, in capsule form, and it can help through the darkest times while you're working through. No addiction either. Any questions, feel free to ask.
I used to have severe bouts of clinical depression in my teens and twenties. Then in 2008 I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism after I found a holistic doctor willing to do a full thyroid panel. 99% of doctors only run a TSH and FT4, but the most important labs are FT3, both antibodies, and RT3 which this doctor actually ran. Lo and behold I found out that I had Hashimoto's thyroiditis.
I was put on thyroid medication and have never experienced "endogenous depression" again. Sure, I experienced terrible grief after my beloved mother died and a lot of depression when I was severely ill. However, I have never ever had a black fog descend on me out of the blue since 2008. I have since learned that depression is a common symptom of hypothyroidism and that T3 is in fact used for treatment resistant depression.
I am not saying you definitely have hypothyroidism, Josh. Just sharing my story in case it helps anyone. I truly believe that there are more physical causes of depression than we realise.
Just found this review article on the use of T3 for treatment resistant depression: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5451035/. It's a very interesting read.
"Black fog" is a good description. I've thought of deep depression as a thick, gray wool blanket over my head and whole body, weighing me down.
That's Winston Churchill via Josh :)
Thank you for sharing this with us. I struggle greatly with social anxiety. Sometimes, I can't even leave the bedroom. At its worst, I'll talk myself out of plans, even if it's something I'm looking forward to. Last Wednesday, I had to talk myself out of talking myself out of attending a stamp club meeting. I picked up my friend and we had a good time. Still, I had to hide myself under a scarf, which did not go unnoticed. When I got in bed that night, I was in physical pain. My shoulders and upper back were screaming. Perhaps forcing myself to leave the house had physical ramifications.
I feel like I'm rambling. I suppose sharing this is cathartic. I'm working on it.
Placentia is a hilarious name for a town.
If you think Placentia is funny, about thirty miles northeast we have a town called Cucamonga.
Social anxiety sucks. As I get older, it gets worse and worse. In my head I know that nobody is going to harm me, but I just can't face going to a house full of people. If I do, I end up feeling like I can't breathe, I'm going to freak out, and I have to escape. I'll do almost anything to get out of going. My wife, a gregarious person, finds my condition to be quite a nuisance.
Placentia is where Bob Harrod went missing.
Once upon a time, I had a friend who struggled as you do. It took me some time to understand that I couldn't hang on tight enough, pull hard enough, pray often enough, or hope fervently enough to pull my friend back from the brink. I finally had to accept that I had no idea how to help, what to say, what to do, when to say or do anything - or say or do nothing. All I could do was reach out to check up with no expectations and promise to be there whenever the clouds lifted.
Words seem inadequate to touch what you've shared and do justice to acknowledging what you go through when your mind betrays you.
The only words I can think to say are - you continue to inspire me, Josh. I am better for having stumbled across your podcast. I'm not going anywhere.
*Thank you*, @kbi, for sharing your hard-won insights. As I’m sure you know, the helplessness that you experienced in caring for your friend is just a sliver of the helplessness that a deeply depressed person feels in his or her darkest moments and struggles. It is moving to read that you acknowledged and came to terms with that helplessness in your role as a caregiving friend. Your willingness to do so, and to be present in the moment with your friend in his or her suffering, very likely made you one of your friend’s strongest allies in his or her depression battle. Moreover, your open acknowledgment of the caregiver’s ultimate helplessness in such situations also likely protected you from falling into that dark pit with your friend, thus shielding you but also importantly making you an even more stalwart ally to your friend.
So glad to hear you're starting to feel better. And oh man, I love this song.